Regaining Compassion

[greymaster98]

I've been thinking a lot about how to regain the compassion that's gone for the moment for my DS11.  How do you regain your compassion after your dear RAD has dished out too much to you?

[DianeM2]

After DS's false allegations, I hated him.  I know this is a strong word, but I did.  I didn't care if he lived or died and in fact I wished at one time that he would die.  (Symptoms of my own anxiety and depression.)  We didn't have contact or even speak to him in over a year.  Then we got a phone call that he had broken his arm.  The first person he asked staff for was ME.  I cried when his case manager called me with all that information.  When I saw him in the hospital, my compassion kicked right back in.  He needed us, and was genuinely glad to see us.  Of course not living with him and dealing with his day to day BS helps.  I am far enough removed to reflect that he has had NO control over what happened to him.  He was brutally abused, neglected, prenatal exposure to alcohol.  His brain is sick.  Even if he develops into some monster, the components needed in his brain to have real feelings do not exist.  I just think of the person he would have been if he would have been given a the chance to start life the right way.  I pray for him constantly.  That's my way of thinking about it anyway.  I know....it's hard.

[justine]

When my well runs dry and i dont feel anything GOOD about my rads, i used to worry and fret and condemn myself.    Now, i may be angry or emotion-less, but i give myself alot more slack.  When i can not STAND my kid i usually have a good reason.  ditto for angry, sad etc.    I accept what i CAN do.....i can care, act like i care, BE caring, pray for them....without my emotions being involved.   I will say, "i may not be able to feel love for him right now, but i can give him supper and a ride and plan for the new school year and hope."   

If i want to test whether i even love her/him, i only have to envison what Diane went through....Do you want the best for your son?  Probably.   Do you hope for his healing and that HE will have a better life?  Probably.    Do you get up everyday doing the best you can, knowing that the little creep could care less that you do?   Yep.    Do you keep him in your home or make plans for a safe place for him to go to if he must?  Yep. 

  If he wakes up down the road someday and calls you to say, "I was awful wasnt I?   I want to be your son, know strings attached.   And i thank you for all you did for me.   Do you forgive me?   Is there anything i can do for YOU?".....would your heart melt?    That tells you that the compassion is there.   When i am strong enough i envision my kid's neglect and losses from their childhood.   When i am not, sometimes the best i can do is to be kind, keep my distance and take care of them as one would do a pet turtle.   That's compassion too.

((((Greymaster)))))

[DianeM2]

   When i am strong enough i envision my kid's neglect and losses from their childhood.   When i am not, sometimes the best i can do is to be kind, keep my distance and take care of them as one would do a pet turtle.   That's compassion too.

Well said. 

....and if my kid pulls more crap on us....will I be able to maintain that compassion?  I don't know. 
....if he in the future ever hurts my daughter or grandchildren physically or sexually...(my worries)....compassion GONE.  FOREVER.

[trying]

Justine, you said it so well.

I used to beat myself up a lot for not feeling compassion any more.  The more I beat myself up, the longer it took to feel compassion again.

Actually, if I tell the truth, I still beat myself up about this.

But one thing I have realized is this:  the moment I get one ounce of 'real' out of my kid, I fall for him again.  That is when I remember that it is the rad I hate, not the kid.  When I can see the real kid that hides under the rad, I really like that kid.

In the meantime, when they can't show me any real, breaks help.  It doesn't have to even be a break away from the family.  It can be an hour of being a little more selfish.  It can be a half day of "I'm not on your healing team today so we'll just get through this for now and we'll start again with healing another time."  It is pretty important, though that I can take that time without feeling too guilty about it or the guilt takes away the benefit. 

If I remind myself it is a temporary break and I'm not giving up as much as getting stronger so I can do this longer, it helps a lot.

[Sparrow]

had a long talk with therapist yesterday. in my case, compassion is a learned skill. apparently i have some subconcious demons inside me that hold it against dd because she is a part of the person who abused both her and myself brutally. and i vowed that when i finally escaped from his abuse, i would never be a part of any of it again. of course, i didnt mean my daughter, but in a subconcious sense, i DID. its very hard for me to look at her as just a hurting little radish. because i see so much of her bio father in her. and i didnt even realize i was doing that! but it makes sense now that the therapist has brought that out. and im trying to learn that compassion that she deserves. but, on a really bad day, we are both pretty much turtles...

[DianeM2]

But one thing I have realized is this:  the moment I get one ounce of 'real' out of my kid, I fall for him again.  That is when I remember that it is the rad I hate, not the kid.  When I can see the real kid that hides under the rad, I really like that kid.

Justine, you expressed what I feel exactly.  That's what makes RADland such a rollercoaster.

 

had a long talk with therapist yesterday. in my case, compassion is a learned skill. apparently i have some subconcious demons inside me that hold it against dd because she is a part of the person who abused both her and myself brutally. and i vowed that when i finally escaped from his abuse, i would never be a part of any of it again. of course, i didnt mean my daughter, but in a subconcious sense, i DID. its very hard for me to look at her as just a hurting little radish. because i see so much of her bio father in her. and i didnt even realize i was doing that! but it makes sense now that the therapist has brought that out. and im trying to learn that compassion that she deserves. but, on a really bad day, we are both pretty much turtles...

Sparrow,
I feel that your feelings only natural and I had a feeling you were struggling with  these subconscious demons.  I don't know if this will help, but can you think of her as just YOURS ? Get possessive.  Get mad.  Say to yourself, "This child is MINE and no one will EVER hurt her again."  Does the therapist have any suggestions for this?  This would  be a good thing to mention to your therapist.  I'm sure you've already thought about that.  Hugs and that was brave of you to share that.

[Sparrow]

thanks you Diane,

thats a new way of thinking about it. i havent tried that before. what ive been doing is making this wall between me and dd so i wont have to get close to her. i almost revolt when she is touching me, and i hate that little body so much sometimes! but really, all though i dont realize it, im revolting against HIM and i hate HIS little body. this little body that HE created. and this little body that HE abused. and i look in the mirror, and see a strong, resourceful woman who has overcome HIM and all his HATE. and i never want to be like him!!! then, when im so angry at dd, and just hate her to death, i look in the mirror again, and see HIM looking back through my eyes, and HIM in a little girl´s bdy standing next to me. and i want to scream and RUN away from all this HATE HATE HATE!

but its all underneath. the real me is trying to be patient, and take deep breaths and not let the demon of HIM overtake me. i guess i learned more of him than i wanted to. and i dont want to ever ever be like him!

but when i see her, im seeing her RAD. and her RAD is saying I HATE YOU!!! her father is her RAD. it makes sense to me now.

because i love the little girl underneath the RAD. but the RAD is her life right now. the HATE and the ugly looks and the rages and screaming and disrespect. the lying and manipulating. the RAD is HIM. and thats what i want to escape from.

[trying]

"i look in the mirror again, and see HIM looking back through my eyes, and HIM in a little girl´s bdy standing next to me. and i want to scream and RUN away from all this HATE HATE HATE!"

Wow, Sparrow, you have put words to something that I have thought about for years.  My radishes are adopted so it is not a "him" that I see when I look in the mirror.  But on the really bad days, I don't see me in the mirror.  I'm not the same mom.  I'm not who I want to be or thought I was.  Sometimes I think I am getting to be as raddy as they are, at least in my feelings in relationship to them. 

It is so hard for me to separate my feelings out from my actions sometimes.  When I have a really tough interaction with one of my ds's where there is a lot of intensity, it doesn't seem to matter later how well I handled it.  My feelings tell me that since I am exhausted and hurt and angry, I must have been a 'bad' mom.  Sometimes I can go back and review the entire conversation and realize that this feeling has no basis in reality.  I stayed calm.  I stayed respectful.  I gave choices.  I didn't engage.  But the intensity of the emotion is there the same as it is when I don't do so well.  I have the same thoughts.

I wonder for myself if that is part of why I have trouble feeling a bond, or compassion...because I feel like a bad mom so often.  People just don't want to get close to those who make them feel bad about themselves.  And that is how my ds's survive.  They need to believe I am bad so that they can justify all their own mixed up emotions.  So that is what I hear in all our interactions.  They don't see me as a mom who will feed them, or give them fun, or who will care about their feelings, or who sees anything good in them.  So they try to control the food, and sneak the fun without permission, and hide their feelings, and refuse to show me the good in them and in some ways, I become who they think I am.  It takes an act of conscious will to moment by moment step out of the cycle.  It is so exhausting sometimes.

I don't know if possibly the treatment we get from our kids abuses us enough that we take on some of their rad and ptsd?  I know that your descriptions of how you don't even want your dd's touch ring true for me---that I don't feel a connection enough to want to touch someone who hates me so much.

I've heard that love is what you do, more than what you feel.  You are working so hard at fighting for this little girl of yours.  It counts for more somehow that you are doing it as a choice, rather than because it comes naturally to you.

[Sparrow]

thank you Trying, for those kind words.

i think i just put those feelings into word sometime yesterday, after my talk with the therapist. it actually makes things a bit easier on me. like i need to lighten up on myself, and not worry so much about being a "good mom". hell, they dont care anyway, do they? of course im trying to be a good mom. but as long as the dd is getting what she NEEDS then she will have to deal with that sometimes. its like that song says, "you dont always get what you want, but you almost always get whatyou need". dd gets what she needs, and a little of what she wants.

and i agree, the treatment we get from our kids is a form of abuse also. we didnt ask for, and dont deserve such treatment, when we are doing more than anyone could comprehend, to make our children happy and healthy. when it gets thrown back in our faces, it IS abuse. and it hurts just as bad. it isnt their fault they are doing that, and probably dont realize that they are doing it. its just a way of life for them. but it still hurts. BAD.

who wants to touch HATE? its impossible to NEVER take it personally.

and at this point, im not really doing it out of choice. im doing for my husband. because he isnt ready to give up on her. i was ready weeks ago. im not seeing the changes that are sticking. i need more from her.

i dont get where people come up with the fact that because she is younger, she has more chance of healing. if she is younger, that just makes it all the more difficult to break the cycle because there is no way to talk to her, reason with her, or even bring on meanigful information or consequences to her.

god, this is hard!

but im keeping on with this. and i knowthat if it doesnt work, then i will have given all i have to give for her. and then some.

[DianeM2]

Sparrow, I sent you a personal message.  A story about another instance that might help or at least show you I understand.

I don't know if possibly the treatment we get from our kids abuses us enough that we take on some of their rad and ptsd?  I know that your descriptions of how you don't even want your dd's touch ring true for me---that I don't feel a connection enough to want to touch someone who hates me so much.

Trying, Wow, lots to mull over here.  We have been abused.  Parents of RADs are abused.  I know I've taken that on.  I know I don't let people "in" as easily anymore.  I'm wary and suspicious. 

I feel that some of the problems with Jake not attaching was because of the ambivilant feelings I have for him.  We're human too and I just don't know how it's possible to put on a false face and look calm and loving at ALL times.  RAD is  a freakin' awful disorder and I detest it.  I detest how it brought out feelings in me that I didn't know existed in my (I thought) kind caring soul.

[trying]

I think the assumption is that when they are younger, they are still in the bonding cycle, so maybe you still have a chance to sort of do it over and minimize the damages.

We got that ds21 that I wrote about in "I'm dying..." when he was nearly 3.  I did not know about rad at the time, and he had a whole host of other issues, including being in the 70's in IQ, having ADHD, and possibly a bit autistic or PDD.  So we floundered for years before finding out anything of rad.

Then we did some modified holding, sometimes as intense as what you are working with, but mostly not.  We felt we were on a road with no guides most of the time.

I don't know that with him it helped that he was young, because we didn't do anything about it when he was young.  He didn't like being snuggled so I didn't snuggle him.  I did what I had to do to get by, not knowing that I should be doing things differently.

DianeM2,  I wonder if the not letting other people 'in' as easily comes as much from how often we have been hurt by other people judging us.  I also am more wary and suspicious of other people than I used to be, but I don't think I started being wary of other people until other people really hurt me.  It was separate from my distance from my ds's who were also really hurting me.  It was still a direct result of parenting a rad.  I would not have experienced that misunderstanding and judgment without also dealing with rad.  But I see in your posts that you are a loving person.  I see you opening yourself up here.  I wonder if your wariness is very understandable hesitance to open yourself up to that kind of judgment again.

Our ds14 was nearly 2 when we got him.  I still did not have a lot of guidance, but by then I knew what rad was and that letting him alone was not a good option.  I decided that I would rock him to sleep at nap times and bed times.  For a year, he cried and fought being rocked and held twice a day.  I wish I had tried a lot more of the stuff that others have told you about, the fun game stuff of making it fun to touch or tease or play with getting eye contact, etc.  I didn't know about that stuff then.

I did all that stuff with my birth kids, so I guess I should have figured it out, but I didn't.  That is just how it is.

He did end up in an rtc last year, and I have written several times about how much progress he made.  At that point he could talk about things and reason.  I don't know if that is what made the difference, because I have seen so many rad kids that age who should be able to talk about it and reason, but who don't for one reason or another.

I am so grateful that this ds did.  I don't know if it is because I was trying in my own faulty way to bond with him already when he was 2 and 3.  I don't know if it is what the rtc did with him.  I don't know if it is that his particular personality is more susceptible to healing.  I don't know if it is because he needed a certain number of nurturing experiences to 'get it' and at 14 he finally had reached the tipping point.  Unfortunately, we still parent mostly with common sense, hunches, guesses and hope, more than with measurable results to specific inputs.

I do know that now that he is 14, it is harder to treat him according to his emotional age rather than his physical age.  At 3 he wasn't hitting the puberty stages of independence that is normal with being a teen.  He hates that his friends can stay home alone when they aren't interested in a family activity.  Heck, I hate that I still have to get a babysitter for a 14 year old.  But he still isn't beyond stealing completely.  He tries most of the time to follow rules, but there are a few slips in that most days.  I can't predict which rule he will decide doesn't count, so he has to have supervision.  At three he expected to have supervision.  Now he chafes at it.

My friend once told me that there aren't easier ages, just different ages.  At three, it is EXTREMELY hard to deal with all the acting out and no logic or reasoning.  At fourteen, there are different issues.  I don't know if they are harder.  The one thing that is scarier is that the mistakes they make at 14+ can change their lives, so their actions have more impact on their future.  But as far as how easy it is to parent or get healing, I don't know.

DianeM2, I don't let other people 'in' as easily either.  I have seen that as a reaction to being hurt by their misunderstanding and judgment as we dealt with things they could not even imagine.  I see you being very loving, and letting people in on this board.  I think we parents of rads have had to learn how to be careful about who we share with and how much we share.  We just don't have the energy to deal with hurt from the outside when we have so much already at home.

[DianeM2]

DianeM2,  I wonder if the not letting other people 'in' as easily comes as much from how often we have been hurt by other people judging us.  I also am more wary and suspicious of other people than I used to be, but I don't think I started being wary of other people until other people really hurt me.  It was separate from my distance from my ds's who were also really hurting me.  It was still a direct result of parenting a rad.  I would not have experienced that misunderstanding and judgment without also dealing with rad.  But I see in your posts that you are a loving person.  I see you opening yourself up here.  I wonder if your wariness is very understandable hesitance to open yourself up to that kind of judgment again.


DianeM2, I don't let other people 'in' as easily either.  I have seen that as a reaction to being hurt by their misunderstanding and judgment as we dealt with things they could not even imagine.  I see you being very loving, and letting people in on this board.  I think we parents of rads have had to learn how to be careful about who we share with and how much we share.  We just don't have the energy to deal with hurt from the outside when we have so much already at home.

Thanks Trying!   
Yes, I think a lot of my not letting people in is also because of being so severely judged by the outside world.  When you are trying your best and people have no idea what you are REALLY living with and are at your wits end feels like abuse too.  I have my 3 closest friends, my Mom and Dad, DH, DD, precious grandkids.  I only let my inlaws in when I feel emotionally capable enough.  I like it this way.  My wall is up, I have the support I need and now I have you wonderful people also. 

On the board I try to send the message that I have "BTDT", totally understand, offer advice for what worked for me, what didn't work.  Feel like I make sense some days and other days I feel like I'm contradicting myself in my posts!   I get nervous sometimes when I hit the Post button!  So afraid of opening up, so afraid of giving the wrong advice.  But I'm here.  I love all you guys.

[Sparrow]

i love you too!!! i feel the same way!

i give all this support and advice to others on here, but many days, i just want to throw the flag in and say F*** it!

then i come here(ive bookmarked the site!) and i get all warm and fuzzy at the comments you guys leave me!
then im ready to keep going, keep trying, and keep giving.

its works out. nobody is perfect, and thats nice to know sometimes.

[merry]

Wow, Greymaster, what an extraordinary question.  It is my belief that just the fact that you are thinking about trying to regain compassion is a huge step in itself.  Let's face it, we HAVE been abused by these children in ways that are often beyond comprehension.  Often times just when we think they have done their worst, they still manage to up the ante.

I remember at our worst times telling our therapist how much I had come to hate myself, because I was no longer the kind, loving person I had been and was feeling like I never wanted to be again.  She basically listened, pointed out that I had every right to feel the way I did, and told me that compassion might start with being kind to myself.  She also let me know that there were others who felt as I did.

We also talked about while our RAD might "win" with living a life that was less than desirable, I did not have to allow her to win and let her make mine miserable.  Now we all know THAT is easier said than done.

Peace,
Merry